Additional written evidence submitted by Dr Jillian Couto-Phoenix, National Manufacturing Institute Scotland (HCC0047)

Q35 –paragraph 5, line 4 (Dr Couto Phoenix narrative):

• please add ‘the Energy Skills Partnership’ as indicated in red here:

In preparation for this panel, I would like to acknowledge fruitful

conversations that I have had with colleagues at NMIS, at University of

Strathclyde, as well as Skills Development Scotland, the Scottish Funding

Council, Scottish Enterprise, the Energy Skills Partnership, the High Value Manufacturing Catapult, Doosan, PA Consulting and BIBB in Germany. Thanks for the opportunity

to be here this afternoon.

In answer to Q43 – “When there comes a point where Scotland or the United Kingdom could export hydrogen—you mentioned, Dr Holmes, about some of the measures that might be needed to be put in place—what other support would be needed to make the most of international trade opportunities for the export of hydrogen?”

• Change ‘no’ to: “Yes, to add to Dr Holmes’ point about Germany, in addition to planning for both the market supply and demand for hydrogen, Germany is also in the early stages of anticipating the skills needs that will underpin the growth of this hydrogen economy. NMIS are working towards an MOU with BIBB (the German Federal Institute for Vocational Education and Training) and as part of that we discussed with them what their perspectives on the skills needed for hydrogen are.  They are currently working on a project to identify these, which started last year and is due to complete in 2024 when they make their recommendations. Critically, this work is embedded in the German National Hydrogen Strategy and if we want to make progress, Scotland and NMIS needs to be undertaking similar work”.

In reference to skills and transition plans and a transition framework, when asked: Is that [a transition framework] something that both Governments are open to or is it something that you are choosing to do independently and getting on with it?

Q50 – paragraph 2, lines 2-7 (Dr Couto Phoenix) – This needs to be clearer. Remove strike through and replace with text in red.

• Dr Couto-Phoenix: No, obviously skills is a devolved issue and so it works slightly different in Scotland versus the rest of the UK. However, because we work with catapult, they had a good report. It was manufacturing the future workforce, and this was a report where they looked at not only the work that we were doing here but also looked at other economies across the world where they are not quite industrialised. However, because we work with the UK High Value Manufacturing Catapult, we have oversight across the country. The Catapult had a good report called manufacturing the future workforce, where they looked at not only the work that we were doing here but also looked at other economies across the world. Again, the lessons learned from that is were that we do require a skills framework this. I know that Skills Development Scotland is looking at working with this framework, and NMIS is part of this because we are working across Scotland.

Q50 – paragraph 3 (Dr Couto Phoenix) – can I please add

• Paragraph 3 currently states “This is something that I think the Governments would be open to but, again, we would need that continuity of funds to be able to plan a demand-led skills model to 2030 and then to 2045 and then 2050”.

• After the full stop on line three, add these lines In reference to other economies, Dr Florian Egli of ETH Zurich has completed an analysis on the suitability of labour market data for supporting skills development in the European Green Transition, particularly around the transitioning from Brown Jobs to Green Jobs in Germany. This was submitted to the 2021 OECD/Cedefop conference on green apprenticeships.  This is particularly relevant for Scotland for the move from O&G to green jobs like Hydrogen and was presented here with NMIS MSA from around the 8 minute mark https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08xjAn0OOA8

When asked “who should be leading the charge?” in regards to forecasting skills (Q54) add an additional point to Mr. Ross’s question STEM in schools:

Education Scotland has set out a Learning for Sustainability Action Plan (LfSAP) which has a vision of entitling every learner to a provision in Sustainability by engaging learners, educators, schools and their communities to build a socially-just, sustainable and equitable society. Relating this to STEM and manufacturing, sustainability practices such as repair and remanufacturing are now being embedded into engineering design curriculums and will therefore be a key component of how we source materials, plan projects, and deliver infrastructure and goods. As all these components will be critical to building the hydrogen and CCUS economy, the LfSAP could support acceptance and talent pipelines into these areas.

May 2022